Monday, October 6, 2008

Permissions, mod team, progress, internship

I had a nice chat with DC last night, and really made clear how happy everyone (including myself) has been with him. I explained to him why I haven't been to happy with him, and also (finally) got permission to do whatever I think is best for TMN, without verifying it with DC.

You all know, the way we chose mods isn't perfect. Last round people applied for a job, which was better, but still not perfect. So, how should we pick our mods? Share your thoughts!
Use the comment option (no need to login) to tell me what's best, what requirements we should stick to, and how to pick mods in general. I'll discuss the comments with DC.

I haven't seen any progress since yesterday, but I think DC will have some time on his hands. Next milestone: Converting about 100 pages to .NET 3.5, and we'd like to do that within 2 weeks.

I already told some people about this on IRC, and I also mentioned I'd post about it once or twice. So here it is.
On September 1st I started internship at Logica, researching, and eventually creating an SMS Service. It's very interesting, and I'll use languages, tools, and hardware I haven't worked with before.
Technical: I'll be using a C#.NET application to communicate with a Terminal using AT-commands, to get a service running, that can respond to SMS messages it receives.
Very interesting!


Anonymous said...

You could just make me a mod marc! =D

(its jackie btw)

Nas said...

Let the game go for a week or two, see which players come back that weren't obviously mentally challenged, and choose them. Although I think the voting system would work again, with assistance from you and DC.

Anonymous said...

I agree with Nas here. Let the game run for a few weeks and if needed, choose a selected amount of active people who aren't completely immature and stupid and actually love to play the game - making it better and helping it in every way.

- Dan

Anonymous said...

Application again, no other way is fairer aslong as each one gets read. Being a mod isn't a popularity contest, voting is a bad idea in my opinion.

Craig said...

i agree ith anonymous i Recon A vote would be a bad idea..

but the application idea sounds very good.

TheWiZard said...

I Agree with nas. Pick a few players that have played the game for years and know it well. then maybe trial them for a few weeks. if not suitable replace them.

Anonymous said...

well.. I think a aplication is best.. Voting will result in corrupt mods...

Anonymous said...

Kronos FTW!

Anonymous said...

Potential moderators should be subjected to questions to see how they would spot cheaters. Simple knowledge of exploiting and scripting would, in my opinion, be an advantage to any moderator. A superb command of the English language is of course a must (Dutch may be helpful as there used to be a lot of Dutch players) as these people need to be clear in what they say in order to avoid confusion.

I agree with the application process idea; though I think successful applicants should have to complete a questionnaire / test to give a clearer insight into their abilities. Give examples of situations and ask how they would deal with them if they were in a moderating position.

Those are the kind of things that should be addressed when choosing a moderator, in my opinion at any rate.

Kronos said...

On a serious note, i can see the dilema between voting and applications.

I dont think mods are essential from day one, the presence of an admin should be sufficient for a week or two.

I stand by the applications method, merely, because that is the fairest, and most effective way of finding mature and sensible people.

I think its important that any new staff, know and understand tmn and tmns history well, So picking someone who has played a while in vital imo. Both for understanding how TMN was previously managed, and to limit the ammount of people that become mods then change their minds.

I suggest a strict application method, unfortunatley, it means you and DC have to read each one, which is why each application should have strict criteria. Such as an X ammount of playing time, previous managerial experience and a genuine interest in making TMN what it once was.

You also said you have voice convo's with DC, this could be a method of final interviews. There's no better way to get an understanding of a person and a persons maturity, than talking to them.

Goodluck with whatever decision you make!

SteV said...

tbh, When you're chosing mod you should take into account, there family, so they havent got brothers, etc, then that clears some of the "corrupt" the mods get, which would be fair, but some would say it's un fair, i guess you just need to look into the person more, not just on what they spend on TMN or what they achieved, yer it needs to be someone who knows about TMN and has played it, it should go down to there pesonallity, not gaming ablilites or how deep there pockets are + it should be about past exp you've had with them, if you have been mates or anything, and like someone said, they should have trails for the top 10 or something, then pick 5 or something or how ever many your wanting.


CookieMonster said...

Applications + good ones get picked for a voice interview on team speak ;)

i think thats a good idea... :)

Anonymous said...

Audio Interview, Use ventrilo, Even let you use mine if you like :)
Also some basic knowledge about coding ect. Applications as well.
Plus if you know them well, e.g On IRC alot and so on

Love Konks :)

Anonymous said...

I think when the game is up put a raffle page so the players can buy raffle tikets. (more you buy better change you get been a mod) make 5 wining tikets, the person that comes first give them a trial if there not good give the secend winner a trial like that.

If that dosent work just do a vote or Application but they must be helpful, know how to and love playing the game and also helpful and must be mature.

Nas said...

Why not combine Applications and Voting? Have the mods pick applications from the best candidates, then have people vote for them. Or vice-versa.

Hk said...

You should definitely pick someone who will be active. This is a definite must have. Activity has always been a problem and if you choose someone who can get on at least 5/7 days a week then it will keep traffic down for complaints and problems, etc.

Raven said...

I say application process first and then a player vote.

You could have moderators assigned to different help desk topics to cut down the overall load of problems and have moderators solve the problems they are best at.

Sabotage Corruption Infiltrate Assassinate said...

Personaly, I think TMNX beta testers should have achoice into the matter of mods, (excluding me), one because Marc had at once put enough trust in them to test it. But, i know most wonde be active, me i know i will atleast for the first few months of the release.. college is calling.. But the testers did a good job in convercing and covering the goals and exploits during the testing faze, and they should be offered out of previous empithy for tmn.

Just my two cents :)

Anonymous said...

I envisage a Battle Royale-esque assessment for those who wish to be moderators.

Take all applicants on a "trip", gas them, kidnap them, and then take them to an isolated island where they'll then be fitted with electronic collars. The applicants must then kill each other until only one remains.

Give them, say a limit of three days in which to kill one another; if a winner hasn't been declared by the end of that three day period then the collars that were fitted at the start of the assessment will explode.

1). Gather applicants together.
2). Gas and kidnap applicants.
3). Place applicants on an abandoned island and attach electronic collars to each individual.
4). Notify the applicants of the rules.
5). ???
6). Profit.

Fuck the voting system, we want an authoritative figure who is capable of killing a man using nothing more than a badger's placenta and a half-eaten Jammie Dodger.

If Bear Grylls was a moderator on TMN, nobody would even contemplate fucking about, as they'd know that the consequences of doing so would result in them being fucked up.

Sean said...

Woundn't it just be eaier and a lot less painful if you and DC choose players that you have talked to, got to know if both versions of TMN, it doesn't matter about how long they have played TMN or tmnX, its about if they can do the tasks that moderators should be able to do, it doesnt matter if they can code or not as that has no impact about the players abbility to do their job right. We all now that its Marc and DC that do all the coding and I don't think that will ever change. You should choose people that can and have trust from both rounds. Some will say do a player vote, but if they new the mod they will be able to cheat for them and nothing will happen, they wont get banned or nothing, it will be just like with BTB, people slagged him off as he had a brother and they thought he was helping him in someway, the same will happen if you let the people decide, it has to be the both of you.


Anonymous said...

Google Ads... You sneaky bastard, Marc.

nas said...

obama 4 mod 08'

Anonymous said...

i still think auditions are better because it gives everyone a chance.
plus voting isnt giving the other s a chance

say you put me CroK in with Dav and kronos then i wouldnt have a chance

and i think that you shopuldnt be mod just because you have an high popularity on the game

just my opinions thanks


Anonymous said...

I think the application way was better where you sendt an email regarding modship.

Anonymous said...

In my opinion deciding on something as crucial as moderators can only be done through applications.

You can't expect this to become a popularity contest.

There have been some valid ideas here, such as a voice chat interview.

I have been part of a hand-picked staff in an MMORPG ( cabal online ) and the way I see it, you need to have people apply for it, select those you think seem fit for it, then submit those to a questionnare.

If they awnser the questions adequatly you can proceed with asking some simple personal information to get to know them a little better.

After that, have a voice chat interview with them, see if you get along and you thing the person is genuine and honest, and make a choise.

I've seen my share of corruption in the 1,5 years of being a Game Advisor in Cabal online ( the european version ) and it has always been dealth with swiftly. This just requires close communication between the moderators and the admins.

~ DarkBasics, YinYang, VoiD, take a pick.

Anonymous said...

You should really try to get back the kick ass mod(s) from previous rounds. The ones that cared about the game, took care of the issues and never played favs to anyone. personally I think if you could get Dev (rNr) back that would be a great start. But thats just my opinion and I am sure lots of people would have issue with that.

Anonymous said...

I agree with what kronos said

7th said...

I think to pick 5 people,
all get a week to let show them how they work...
(if they ban someone, and it's unfair, Can DC or Marc uban them)
and look hows the best...
mods can make accounts and spam the game forum, then van they see what's they are doing in that moment....

PDX said...

:o Mods should SERIOUSLY be people who have the endurance[mentally/physically] to CONTINUOUSLY be able to withstand being able to log onto TMN to solve problems, take abuse, and other stuff multiple times a week for more than just a few weeks. My other standards for mods would be too high to expect ^_^ MuaHaHaHa...

Kronos said...

Well i think most of it has been covered now,

I do think my suggestion for a voice interview should be considered, im sure people could find a mic somewhere, and if not, a thorough text interview should be sufficient.

Online time is a definate thing to consider, asit learning capability and overall intelligence/common sense.

I think, email applications followed by a role playing/problem solving exercise/questionnaire, followed by a final voice/msn interview.


ShowerCurtains said...

Marc, i think you should make me a MOD! I tick all the boxes! Dont have a brother or sister! Id be on all the time! And id be quick and reliable at solving problems etc.

ShowerCurtains... :)

Anonymous said...

Problem solving exercises? Role playing? That's the type of shit you'd expect if you applied to be the CEO of an organization, not a moderator on an online game.

As long as the people who get picked aren't illiterate, Jewish, or stuck up their own arse, then I'll be more than happy.

The bird is the word!

The person above me is gay! said...

You misunderstood.

Simple 'what would you do in such and such situation' questions.

That comes under role playing and problem solving. Noob.

SaW said...

Opinions Are Like Arse Holes.. Everyone has One. And sometimes they stink. Many of yours does =)

Anyways, Moderators should be chosen by how long they have been playing the game (That does not mean only old school players should be mods) and how much understanding they have for the game. And of course by how much they are online.

But most of all, the understanding for the game part is important. Not just for the game, but for the consumers to. And I know some of u might not like me for this or think that this is irrelevant, but i think ppl that hasn't been in crews (EC, AEC, S-Unit whatever) should be the ones chosen to be Mods. Known ppl that has been in crews, can easily take part in an discussion.
- We don't want an "corrupt" mod now do we..?


Anonymous said...

So in other words, a questionnaire?

And I've just had to endure writing a 10-page assignment on quantitative and qualitative research, so I think I might just know one or two things about questionnaires.

tl;dr Kronos is a fucking Jew.

Anonymous said...

Opinions Are Like Arse Holes

In that case, some of the people posting in here are huge fucking opinions.

JewishKronos said...

Yay. Im a Jew.ym

Anonymous said...

Also to add, I think the elected/selected mods should be on a probationary basis in the beginning. Corruption in any form or the resonable speculation of it should not be tolerated.


noodles said...

I've always thought you should choose the ones that kept coming back round after round. The guy everyone seemed to enjoy, is active and would actually help people.

WizzyWizWozWizTheWiZyyWazzaWiZarD said...

I Love the way that everyones 'Idea' slightly gives them the upper hand, making them an ideal candidate for mod. lol.

Anonymous said...

To be honest I don't think the game needs 10's of mods if the server is going to be I'd already has beef improved and marc and Steve ars going to spending more time online themselves then I really can't see there being a great need for more then one or two other mods to help out. As I believe someone else has already posted a vote would turn it into a popularity. The admin should just invite people who they feel are right as the game grows again.

Sorry if there are any spelling mistakes, stupid iPhone


PDX said...

hmm... getting a player that
- has played long :o
- have good TMN understanding :o
- online a lot :o
- uncorrupted :o
- doesn't have another relative playing :o
- friendly :o
- helps others :o
- able to solve most situations :o
- able to take abuse from others :o
- easy to contact :o
- other stuff :o

wonder where you'd find one of those :P

Anonymous said...

- wasnt "the bus driver"
- didnt want to rule the entire game
- wasn't apart of any council, unit, crew, clan, posse, etc...

On a serious note before the game is released revamp the TOS. Even the best mod is as good as the rules he's obligated to follow. Really, we have been at this for 4 years now. You know where the loop holes/knots are. Nothing really should be left up to random interpretation where 3 mods can come up with 3 different ways of seeing it.


Haylie =] said...

Haylie is clearly the best choice for mod!


Kronos said...

Haylie is my future wife.

PDX said...

well if theres a mod tryout, ima try out for it kk? :o just to scare you peoples up >:o

PDX said...

also, for the record, it wasnt trying to rule the game, it was E-global domination ~_~ which i somewhat achieved in a way :0

Anonymous said...

I think i should be a mod because im a Level 87 Champion warlord with a + 7 Great sword and a + 9 Warriors robe of gondor on dungeons and dragons!!!


Anonymous said...

Lol just waiting for the server to get back up :P

nass said...

When is it going to be back online so I can some, see what horrible choices are mods, and leave again? :(

Ramrod said...

DC, Marc, You've been picking Mods longer than any of us, so I'm sure you can do a fine job. Actually I know you can do a fine job, because the mods of old were fair and good. People get pissed for whatever reason, but the fact is the mods were good. Let's just get the game up again, get the mods picked, and everyone needs to shutup about it.

BennieTheBrick said...

Glad to see you finally got what you wanted, being able to act without having to wait for permission. Should make things alot easier. Also nice to hear you made it clear to him how "happy" everyones been with him.

The assignment on your internship sounds pretty cool! Hows the working 5 days a week going for you? ;)

AgentOrange said...

Marc, just pick the mods yourself :) I'm sure you and DC can do fine :) Don't let it come to a player vote, this will get you corrupt mods.

Note: you can't pick the perfect mod, because people will always be shitting around about them ^^


Anonymous said...

I agree the New Mods should have no family playing the game, The whole MaX and BTB was a total joke and ruined the game, We need the new mods to be active and also we shouldnt vote for the new mods, you and DC should choose the mods, because 75% of the players will want their mates to be mods

HoodRich said...

I <3 TMN! I want to make love to all the true TMN players who are just as excited as I am to play again. :P

Noodles do you remember me fag?
We used to race to EOTS and talk on MSN... though many people did that O_o

TheHolySpirit said...

To be honest you should pick someone who has been there since round 1 when it was green. Keep Devious & Dev's.

- TheHolySpirit

Anonymous said...

Marc you sexeh beast do what you think is best! :)

nuff luv from hazi ^_^

roughNready aka Dev said...

Hmm, TMN relaunching again. Will have to swing by and check it out again. Hopefully returning to the Old School TMN will bring new 'old' life back into TMN.

Mods are always a bitch to pick. No matter who is picked/selected someone will always have a problem, thats the nature of Mods.

By the way Marc... contact me havent talked to you in ages.

You should still have the email addy ;)

Control said...

What about credits?